The Second Round
Deadline: Saturday, November 5, 2005, 9pm CET
The Rules
This time we try to explore strategies which works under both, normal and LP rules. P-space and PIN are
again forbidden.
All matches are devided into two parts using different max. Processes. The first battle
will be fought with max. processes of 8000, while the second under secret low process conditions.
It's only known that the max. processes for the second battle will be in the range between 20 and 50.
The predefined variable MAXPROCESSES is forbidden.
You may wonder why I use secret low process conditions. Because I want to prevent strategy decisions
using parallel processes to identify the LP max. processes setting ;-)
The score of both battles are added to decide the winners.
Again one entry per author.
The parameter setting are:
Coresize | 8192 |
max. Cycles | 100000 |
max. Processes | 8000 and 20>?>50 |
max. Warrior Length | 100 |
min. Distance | 100 |
p-space | forbidden |
Restrictions | MAXPROCESSES is forbidden |
Rounds | each with 1000 |
The commands for pmars is:
pmars -s 8192 -c 100000 -p ____ -l 100 -d 100 -r 1000 |
Fixtures and Results
Fizmo's Comment
Well, that's a match I can't predict anything but I guess both will enter with a scanner.
I know that's el kauka's favourite strategy. Let's see if I'm right.
The Comments
The Results
No entry received from brx, so el kauka wins this match by default.
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 100.0 | 0.0 | 0.0 |
dark return of test | el kauka | 300.00 | 100.0 |
2 | 0.0 | 100.0 | 0.0 |
no entry | brx | 0.00 | 0.0 |
Battle SR1 | Result |
---|
brx | 0 |
el kauka | 600 |
Jens Gutzeit vs. Roy van Rijn |
Fizmo's Comment
The Paper-Guy meets the Allrounder. I am pretty sure Roy will send something unexpected.
Does Jens continue with paper? That's the big question.
The Comments
Jens Gutzeit:
The Making of "No 3735928559"
=============================
Life can be so unfair! At first fiveop was my opponent. We
both aren't that long into corewar and that is why I thought
my chances of winning to be close to 50:50. And now? Because
of that mysterious bug Roy is my opponent. And fiveop got John
Metcalf. Now we both are doomed, but at least we still have a
little chance of winning (i.e. if our opponents don't submit
their warriors ;-)
Normal papers don't do well under LP-conditions and LP-papers
aren't that good under "normal" conditions either. That is why
I think, that Roy will submit a stone, imp, clear or scanner.
I hope it to be a scanner. If not I'm doomed.
At first I was thinking about a simple stone with imps, but I
couldn't make it work properly under both settings. So I've
looked for something better and found clears. SD-/SSD-clears
don't work well under LP, so a simple d-clear had to be good
enough.
That's it.
And no, that isn't a stupid name. It has taken several hours to
choose it. ... quite a "beefy" name ;-)
Roy van Rijn:
To win you need a good name, I learned that from Jens
so this is the time to fight fire with fire.
The name: "la flufis. mrobi'o" means:
"The Fluffy is dead" in Lojban (the language Jens loves)
For the warrior, I could not decide on a strategy so
I used just about everything
This warrior has:
Scan (qscan)
Clear (SD)
Stone
Paper (LP type)
Imps (3point Afield impring)
...
And a boot to make it complete
And if it works..? No idea, lets find out..
The Results
Roy send a 'patchwork' warrior with lot of different parts while Jens sent a stone/clear. Both
entries were using a qscanner. Roy's la flufis. mrobi'o slightly dominates both matches
which gave him a clear victory.
The HP Match
The LP Match
The Final Score
Battle SR2 | Result |
---|
Jens Gutzeit | 233.30 |
Roy van Rijn | 285.80 |
Fizmo's Comment
Fernandez already showed a good performance in the qualification round to stand up in a very strong
group. On the other hand Mizcu is also quite familar with all strategies.
The Comments
S. Fernandes:
Against Mizcu I haven't much chance. Maybe I will be lucky.
The Results
What a close match!!! Two scanner clashes together and only one can survive. A lucky victory for S.
Fernandes.
The HP Match
The LP Match
The Final Score
Battle SR3 | Result |
---|
S. Fernandes | 282.90 |
Mizcu | 275.40 |
Fizmo's Comment
Inversed already showed not only in the qualification that he's cram-full with good ideas. Datagram
seems the "underdog" in this match, but that makes him difficult to predict.
The Comments
datagram:
For my fans: ( Fluffy <_< >_>) I tried to write a stone/imp/partial clear
Depending on the LP settings.......I might get owned
With a super optimized cool qscan, though
So that makes me semi happy
But I got imps right
And qscans
That's good enough to lose
inversed:
Few modern warriors would score good with such rules
but many older ones feel just fine: Iron Gate, Blue Funk,
B-Panama X worked with only a few changes. I've tried
different strategies, but this worked best amongst my warriors.
It only looses to papers and spl/jmp scanners with good gates
(Romulan Warbird for example). Let's hope that datagram's
entry isn't one of those. And it has some problems if
maxprocesses is 24. It'd be ridiculous if it is.
The Results
Clear/imps vs. stone/clear/imps. Sounds like a pretty close match, but inversed got a clear
victory with his clear/imps.
The HP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 37.9 | 14.5 | 47.6 |
Wash'n'Go | inversed | 161.30 | 100.0 |
2 | 14.5 | 37.9 | 47.6 |
Human | datagram | 91.10 | 56.5 |
The HP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 50.7 | 17.4 | 31.9 |
Wash'n'Go | inversed | 184.00 | 100.0 |
2 | 17.4 | 50.7 | 31.9 |
Human | datagram | 84.10 | 45.7 |
The Final Score
Battle SR4 | Result |
---|
datagram | 175.20 |
inversed | 345.30 |
Fizmo's Comment
John seems the clear favourite. He's already aprove that in the qualification round. But I guess
fiveop will send something unexpected. We'll see.
The Comments
John Metcalf:
Fiveop is quite capable of writing and submitting any strategy. The two different
process counts make paper awkward, so Fiveop will probably avoid paper.
What will Fiveop assume I will submit? The most obvious choice would be a scanner.
Fiveop most likely knows I won't choose a scanner for this very reason.
Thinking about what to send doesn't seem to get me anywhere, so I'll flip a coin.
Heads a scanner, tails a bomber...
A bomber it is! Spl/jmp stun bombs work well under both process counts so I'll
use these. Just in case, I'll add a qscan, airbag and imps. :-)
fiveop:
I've decided to write a stone/imp, because I thought good papers won't
be possiblle with only 20-50 processes. So only stones and scanners left and
stones beat scanners ... This is the most obviouse choise and I hope Metcalf
doesn't think I'm so dumb to choose it. ;)
The Results
Clear
The HP Match
The LP Match
The Final Score
Battle SR5 | Result |
---|
John Metcalf | 316.60 |
fiveop | 243.40 |
Sascha Zapf vs. Chip Wendell |
Fizmo's Comment
Both player can handle all kind of strategies, so it's difficult to predict anything. I guess both
will send some defensive style warriors. So, who has added a qscanner to turn the balance?
The Comments
Sascha Zapf:
Hi,
puuuhhh at qualification i get the right strategy. Three
scissor are enough fodder for my Paper/Stone. But now, Chip is waiting...
After his nice work on corewin and his awesome 4 in a
row success at Redcoders Frenzy Tournament he has my respect. I see two
points of matter.
1) What strategy can score good under 8000 processes and under
20-50 processes without use of MAXPROCESSES or any other detection
of MAXPROCESSES. Try to detect if 50 Procs or more needs to spl 64
proceeses and look if that works, and if not use LP-strategy...
2) What would Chip use ?
For 1)
O.K, with 40 Processes you can design a nice and fast coreclear-paper
with a lower need of procs per instance. But here, we don't know if
it's 20 or 30 or 49. So common paper are not a good choice.
Scanner, usually working with 1 process, so there is no difference
for them. After a direct hit at the spl a clear running with 50 procs
is much faster down as one runnign with 8000, but when working both doing
their job.
Stones - While bombing stones with 20-50 procs are as much as powerfull
then the 8000er one and as much as weak like the clear...
So, scanner or stone seems the strategy of my choice.
For 2)
It seems that Chip preferences Recon2 as a scanner. In 3 of the 4 rounds
he won he did it with a Recon2-clone.
And i hope for that and my entry will be a Anti-Scanner-Optimized Stone/Imp
with Qscan as nice decoy.
Hope for the best - and may be the core with me...
Chip Wendell:
1. Rule #1: Don't worry about what Sascha may or may not submit. In single-elimination
battles like this, luck is about 75% of the result, and if I try to out-guess him, I'll
end up going in circles.
2. So, grab a bunch of the best warriors I can find, and see which ones work best at
both 8000 and 20-50 processes. The ICWS hills are '88 only, which probably won't produce
the strongest warriors, so I'll raid 94nop Koenigstuhl. Grab 10 of the best, do a round-robin
at both 8000 and 30, throw out the worst, repeat, and I'm left with 6 benchmark warriors at
8000 coresize, mostly S/Ps.
3. Now I need to see what strategy works best against them at both process sizes. I'll adjust
to 8192 coresize later. The strongest of them seem to be the S/Ps, and I'm about to choose
one of them, when I happen to run Fizmo's Elven King (the basis for my qualification round
entry) against them, and discover that it beats the tar out of all of them, at all process
limits!
4. But I already used Elven King for the last round. Will Sascha anticipate this? Who cares;
see Rule #1. If he guesses right, I'll tip my hat to him.
5. So I adjust Elven King to 8192 coresize, and find a step size that works best. It suicides
at a very few of the smaller process limits, but it's the best I can do on such short notice.
I'll submit it, and make a note to add Fizmo to my Christmas list.
The Results
Clear
The HP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 22.6 | 14.7 | 62.7 |
Cave Troll | Chip Wendell | 130.50 | 100.0 |
2 | 14.7 | 22.6 | 62.7 |
Modus operandi | Sascha Zapf | 106.80 | 81.8 |
The LP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 52.3 | 39.4 | 8.3 |
Cave Troll | Chip Wendell | 165.20 | 100.0 |
2 | 39.4 | 52.3 | 8.3 |
Modus operandi | Sascha Zapf | 126.50 | 76.6 |
The Final Score
Battle SR6 | Result |
---|
Sascha Zapf | 233.3 |
Chip Wendell | 295.70 |
German Labarga vs. Simon Wainwright |
Fizmo's Comment
Well, I know both from making good oneshots. Do they choose it also for this round? Then I guess
the better scan step will turn the balance.
The Comments
German Labarga:
There are not many warriors that work well under both normal and lp
settings but scanners and oneshots. It might be hard to make a paper for this round.
I don't know much about Simon's warriors, but i know he has some
nice oneshots, so i decided to create an agressive warrior against oneshots
and scanners, having some anti-imp cappability too, so i can
get some points if he submits a paper.
The strat is basically a stone/clear
The stone bombs with empty core and also with an anti-clear bomb
I don't know if i should call it bomber or stone.
It is quite fast and disruptive, and self hits to become
a slow core clear. It seems to be very effective.
The clear only makes one SPL pass and not even complete,
for not to hit the bomber with SPL's and slow-down the warrior.
It kills the bomber with dats and remains as an anti-imp tool.
The clear just has to stun imp spirals, stones and other clears,
and does its duty well.
Obviously this warrior has nearly no chance against papers
and certain weird lp variations like Roy's DaubFusion.
I finaly attemped to add a Qscan, but had no time to
fit one and make it work on a 8192 core.
I hope not to see something paper-ish from Simon.
The Results
Clear
The HP Match
The LP Match
The Final Score
Battle SR7 | Result |
---|
German Labarga | 309.40 |
Simon Wainwright | 253.00 |
Michal Janeczek vs. Zul Nadzri |
Fizmo's Comment
Again it's pretty difficult to say. I expect Michal send a kind of KISS, while Zul may choose a paper.
If so, I think Michal will take in a close match the victory.
The Comments
Michal Janeczek:
As usual I didn't have the time to make a proper entry, hence the
name ;) My initial plan was a combination of KISS (2 ssd clears),
CIA-style bomber (which would suicide after one confirmed enemy hit
- a safeguard against scanners, KISS should work against everything
else in LP), and a low overhead detection for high process round
(which would simply kill one of KISS clears if a SPL in late game
failed). Instead, this stone/imp will have to be enough :) I'm expecting
a scanner or maybe a light stone/imp - I think these are only regular
strategies that will work well in both environments. My warrior should
have advantage against these both types - in theory. I see too many
flaws in this warrior (especially against scanners) to have any
confidence, and that's assuming I predicted opponent's strategy!
Zul Nadzri:
After some thinking, I concluded this round is too sharp.
The key is guessing the opponent strategy correctly.
I assume that at low process, a scanner is excellent.
But that scanner is beaten by many other scanners.
Now, I am back to square one.
Then I decided to go with Spiritual Blank Dimension (SBD)
I changed the variables but still couldn't find the optimum.
Last minute call will be the 100% unchange code for SBD
But I feel bad for using 100%, 'no effort' deliverable
Besides, Fizmo will not be happy to see his warrior beign smashed by Michal
So, I decided to come back to my RF24 warrior of choice 'TIME'
The overall strategy so far:
a) Never forget to encode the word John in this warrior
b) Select a good name
c) Change the constant so that this warrior is 'my creation'.
On item b) I was tipped during the last IRC session... choose a good name.
Or rather, choose an innocent name such as Harmless Fluffy Bunny
It may give some advantage for being so 'dearly'
Shown as per the title:
"Harmless" (hmmm, cool) + "Fluffy" (wow) + "Bunny" (so cuteeee)
How would you expect to 'kill' this lovely 'creature'?
That was what I was been told by the author
So first I am using 66% of the original charming name and add another 34% of neutral name
On item c) I am still changing the variable to meet the 8192 cores
status now - work in progress but must submit a variant
My hands and fingers sore... not sure how many more should I try.
Weak against f-scanner which is weak to wimp which is weak to SDM
if my opponent using f-scanner, I'm finished !
The Results
Wow, what a close match. Zul sent a paper, while Michal a stone/imp. The paper slightly wins
both matches.
The HP Match
The LP Match
The Final Score
Battle SR8 | Result |
---|
Michal Janeczek | 195.00 |
Zul Nadzri | 239.40 |
The Second Chance Tournament Tree Fixtures
There is a second chance for all players who wants to continue the CSEC2005:
Here are the fixtures for the second round:
Nenad Tomasev vs. John K. Lewis |
The Results
Nenad sent a stone/imp while John sent a scanner. As expected from the stone/scissor/paper-anthology Nenad
achieved a pretty clear victory.
The Comments
Nenad Tomasev:
I had two options:
a) adapt Deathstar to tourney conditions - it should do well in both lp and normal
b) expect a scanner and make a quickhack s/i - I did that.
It was a little troublesome to make it work in LP and it's still not very good. I'll
send a better version to 94t later I didn't want to use any of the stones from my other
s/i, so I took a qsilver stone approach. in short: if my opponent sends a paper or a
clear/imp, I'm finished. if he chooses a scanner... well, then he is history. a gamble,
as in the round 1. however, I doubt that I'll do any better now.
The HP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 81.1 | 12.5 | 6.4 |
entryInVain | Nenad Tomasev | 249.70 | 100.0 |
2 | 12.5 | 81.1 | 6.4 |
RedPixel.3 | John Lewis | 43.90 | 17.6 |
The LP Match
# | %W | %L | %T | Name |
Author | Score | % |
1 | 75.3 | 6.5 | 18.2 |
entryInVain | Nenad Tomasev | 244.10 | 100.0 |
2 | 6.5 | 75.3 | 18.2 |
RedPixel.3 | John Lewis | 37.70 | 15.4 |
The Final Score
Battle | Result |
---|
Nenad Tomasev | 493.80 |
John K. Lewis | 81.60 |
X-man won't continue the tournament
As I already told in the case of an odd number, I'll fill the gap hopefully giving a good challenge in the spare time I have beside the tournament organization.
Useful Stuff
Hmm, this time I can't give much hints, because I also have no idea ;-) Nevertheless, here are
at least the Imp-Steps for coresize 8192.
Imp-Points | Imp-Step |
3 | 2731 |
5 | 3277 |
7 | 3511 |
9 | 3641 |
11 | 2979 |
The Off-Topic Round-Robin Results
The -p 8000 Results
The -p 37 Results
The Overall Results
Author | score |
Michal Janeczek | 337.07 |
inversed | 336.91 |
Zul Nadzri | 311.73 |
German Labarga | 309.84 |
S. Fernandes | 303.48 |
Roy van Rijn | 294.42 |
Nenad Tomasev | 289.15 |
Mizcu | 284.51 |
John Metcalf | 278.80 |
Simon Wainwright | 276.79 |
datagram | 270.77 |
fiveop | 239.44 |
Jens Gutzeit | 208.77 |
el kauka | 206.80 |
Sascha Zapf | 205.96 |
Chip Wendell | 201.37 |
John K. Lewis | 171.08 |
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